Bethesda’s answer to Ellsworth Drive
By Silver Springer • May 20th, 2008 • Category: Real Estate, Silver Springer
To all those calling Ellsworth drive in the Downtown Silver Spring Project “Disney land†you’ll be pleasantly surprised when you see Bethesda Lane. Let me start off by saying that in my opinion I think Bethesda Lane looks great, above average architectural detail for this area and lacking any blank walls. But one could argue that walking down Bethesda Lane is like walking through Universal Studios, the Hotels/Casinos on the Las Vegas Strip (try Le Village Buffet) or the “often emulated” Disney experience. Even though in turn these places are emulating cities in Europe and archicture from the Art Deco age etc. It sure does beat the dated early 80’s “stripes†that you can still see being used on new buildings up the I-270 corridor.
When it comes to large properties like Bethesda Lane and Downtown Silver Spring I honestly don’t know what people expect developers to do. Sure they could have been better but they could’ve been a lot worse too. You could build the project in phases over 100 years so you can get that “authentic look” but by then everybody who could even remember would be dead.
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I haven’t been over to Bethesda since this openned.. but a general comment about the “I don’t know what people expect developers to do” comment. And I expect them to do exactlly what they are doing, provide the minimum amount of detail and aesthetic necessary to make the project as profitable as possible.. they’re businesses, that’s their job. In Bethesda, that detail is more profitable given the population, hence they add more of it. But that’s exactly why our expect our governing bodies to impose zoning that addresses aesthetics rather than only land use and building height.
[quote comment="4391"]I haven’t been over to Bethesda since this openned.. but a general comment about the “I don’t know what people expect developers to do” comment. And I expect them to do exactlly what they are doing, provide the minimum amount of detail and aesthetic necessary to make the project as profitable as possible.. they’re businesses, that’s their job. In Bethesda, that detail is more profitable given the population, hence they add more of it. But that’s exactly why our expect our governing bodies to impose zoning that addresses aesthetics rather than only land use and building height.[/quote]
I agree but in an increasingly competitive market like Silver Spring , I don’t understand why some developers think they can cheapen out the architecture. Just look at the JBG project Silver Spring Gateway.
Wait . . . they finished this already? Last time I was in Bethesda (last summer) it was still a hole in the ground. That’s scary.
I’d have to go down there and take a look, but what I see in the photo doesn’t look that nice. The proportions are weird, and I don’t like the tunnel - imagine the poor guys who have to live under there. (I guess they’re probably trolls.)
And, I mean, Bethesda Row’s always had a better reputation for design than Downtown Silver Spring. I don’t think this would do much to hurt them.
[quote comment="4393"]Wait . . . they finished this already? Last time I was in Bethesda (last summer) it was still a hole in the ground. That’s scary.
I’d have to go down there and take a look, but what I see in the photo doesn’t look that nice. The proportions are weird, and I don’t like the tunnel - imagine the poor guys who have to live under there. (I guess they’re probably trolls.)
And, I mean, Bethesda Row’s always had a better reputation for design than Downtown Silver Spring. I don’t think this would do much to hurt them.[/quote]
I forgot to add that the space is not very programmable/flexible unlike Ellsworth drive. I felt claustrophobic. I wonder why Bethesda Row has a better design reputation, the first phase was pretty bland and the Office component cant touch 8515 Georgia.
I’ve been to the Bethesda Lane section at Bethesda Row and my opinion is that the overal design, quality and detailing is exemplary, especially given the cost of land and building materials today.
Once they finish the pots/plants/landscaping and add people it will be a very pleasant place to be indeed, even if you aren’t buying anything.
Sure, there can always be “more”, but as previous posters have appropriately noted, the developer is in it to make a profit. He/she is limited by the “numbers”, how deep his/her pockets are and how big his/her ego is.
For the critics who say it looks fake, they should take a closer look. It’s not fake, it’s new. The streets of Europe we find so charming are centuries old, but many of the paving/streetscape materials are from ‘restorations’ completed in the past 20 years. When done sensitively, the average pedestrian never notices the difference.
Federal Realty Trust generally builds properties that are a class act. We should commend them for doing it right.
[quote comment="4395"]I’ve been to the Bethesda Lane section at Bethesda Row and my opinion is that the overal design, quality and detailing is exemplary, especially given the cost of land and building materials today.
Once they finish the pots/plants/landscaping and add people it will be a very pleasant place to be indeed, even if you aren’t buying anything.
Sure, there can always be “more”, but as previous posters have appropriately noted, the developer is in it to make a profit. He/she is limited by the “numbers”, how deep his/her pockets are and how big his/her ego is.
For the critics who say it looks fake, they should take a closer look. It’s not fake, it’s new. The streets of Europe we find so charming are centuries old, but many of the paving/streetscape materials are from ‘restorations’ completed in the past 20 years. When done sensitively, the average pedestrian never notices the difference.
Federal Realty Trust generally builds properties that are a class act. We should commend them for doing it right.[/quote]
Well said.
I actually did visit Bethesda Lane today, walking around the whole block, and the only big complaint I have is that it does feel very overwhelming and claustrophobic. The street itself is fine - probably about the same proportions as Ellsworth - and it’s got residential on top, which makes the space a lot more dynamic and visually interesting than the big blank walls on Ellsworth.
However, I hate the bridges on the ends. They just make the entire project feel like one giant box instead of several buildings, as the architects and developers would like you to believe. The giant arches on each end make the space feel like it’s very exclusive - which may be Federal Realty’s intention, because there are some very hoity-toity shops in here, from the looks of things - but it doesn’t do a lot to create an inviting urban space.
That said, this will be a good thing for Bethesda, which for all of the success it’s had with Bethesda Row has never given its residents a real green or plaza to spend time in. I’ve heard a lot of people down there complain they don’t have something like “the Turf” or Rockville Town Square Plaza (yes, that IS the name).
[quote comment="4397"]I actually did visit Bethesda Lane today, walking around the whole block, and the only big complaint I have is that it does feel very overwhelming and claustrophobic. The street itself is fine - probably about the same proportions as Ellsworth - and it’s got residential on top, which makes the space a lot more dynamic and visually interesting than the big blank walls on Ellsworth.
However, I hate the bridges on the ends. They just make the entire project feel like one giant box instead of several buildings, as the architects and developers would like you to believe. The giant arches on each end make the space feel like it’s very exclusive - which may be Federal Realty’s intention, because there are some very hoity-toity shops in here, from the looks of things - but it doesn’t do a lot to create an inviting urban space.
That said, this will be a good thing for Bethesda, which for all of the success it’s had with Bethesda Row has never given its residents a real green or plaza to spend time in. I’ve heard a lot of people down there complain they don’t have something like “the Turf” or Rockville Town Square Plaza (yes, that IS the name).[/quote]
Good observation but Bethesda Lane is definitely more narrow than Ellsworth drive (larger side walks, Silver Plaza etc). My biggest gripe with Bethesda Lane and Rockville Town Center is their orientation to the sun. Height has nothing to do with it. The buildings aren’t that tall (only 5 - 7 stories) but yet you always feel like you’re in the shadows.
While the developer, architects, and engineers wanted to maximize space, the project’s layout results in blocking out the sun and making it feel depressing (Rockville TC) or claustrophobic(Bethesda Lane). On the other hand Ellsworth drive is always open and bright because of it’s orientation and set backs.
I paced out Bethesda Lane yesterday and got it to be about 45′-50′ wide, which is comparable to Ellsworth (estimated 25′ for the street, 10-15′ for sidewalks on either side) excluding Silver Plaza. It’s also similar to Gibbs Street in Rockville Town Square. If Bethesda Lane (which is north-south) didn’t have those stupid bridges, then they’d get direct sunlight at all times; ditto for Rockville Town Square, which has a six-story building directly to the south. Ellsworth gets more southern light not just because the buildings on either side are shorter but because even though the Discovery Building is directly to the south, it’s all the way across Georgia Avenue, meaning that the light can reach the other side.